Thursday, September 09, 2010

Severn SITREP II - Electric Boogaloo

Well, something good came out of this, I guess.
Sept. 8, 2010

Subj: Midshipman USNA Social & Internet Media Guidance

In light of increased midshipmen desire to participate in social media sites and post imagery (videos and photographs), the following guidance is provided. The underlying intent of this guidance is that participants not discredit themselves, the Naval Academy or the naval service.

Consistent with Department of Navy policies, USNA midshipmen are free to visit and participate in mainstream social media websites and blogs (e.g. Facebook, MySpace, Twitter) and post imagery to the internet (e.g. YouTube, Flickr) as long as their comments or conduct are not unbecoming an officer and do not violate:

the Uniform Code of Military Justice;
provisions of the Privacy Act; and
Navy regulations regarding protection of operational security and classified information.
As future leaders of Sailors and Marines, midshipmen should not post imagery or comments that would cause anyone to question their judgment, credibility or competence as an officer.

While military members retain basic First Amendment rights (i.e. freedom of expression), military members are also responsible for appropriately representing the naval service. Personal actions can have professional ramifications. USNA midshipmen must always remember that they represent those Sailors and Marines on active duty as well as those veterans and alumni who have served our nation honorably.

As a reminder, while technology increasingly makes it easier to post comments, photos and other imagery, it becomes equally hard, if not impossible, to retract content once it is posted and becomes public. The unfortunate result it that videos/photos posted to these websites remain viewable for a very long time to anyone with access to the internet - including your current (and future) family, relatives, friends, fellow service members and future bosses and employers. The time to consider the propriety of content is before it is posted, not after.

Any questions concerning this guidance or any social media related issues should be referred to the USNA public affairs staff at x[redacted] or [redacted]@USNA.edu.

R/

CDR Joe Carpenter, USN

USNA Public Affairs Officer

92 comments:

Byron said...

Sounds like the tide is turning. The members of the football team better put down the bongs and pick up their books.

Doug Roberts said...

Extremely well-written and sane guidance.  Sort of amazing, however, that it took the words on this blog to move the Naval Academy to action.  I guess the USNA leadership has been so consumed by Diversity Directorate guidance that they couldn't find the time to be more proactive in anticipating other important leadership issues.  It's not like YouTube hit the Web last week...  Wasn't hard to see this one coming...  As they say, we always tend to fight the last battle.

LT B said...

The young ladies have certainly started something.  I do not think the academy needs to be too heavy handed.  This will do for now and the mids have been put on notice.  And there are many that need to read and heed.  Good guidance throughout the Fleet.

UltimaRatioRegis said...

We owe it all to Phib Salamander and Mister T's Haircut!

Grotopotamus said...

Agree with the rest - well-written, appropriate and clearly stated for the audience, and not bogged down with impenetrable, heavy-handed management-speak.

I spent wayyy to much time perusing yesterday's comments from the sidelines and must commend our host and the usual suspects, porch-dwellers and all, for largely maintaining respectful disagreements, "rabbit-holes" notwithstanding.  A problem was spotted and ultimately dealt with (rapidly!), which is more than I got done yesterday. Nicely done.

Byron said...

Amazing, the people who read this blog and never say a word...

Grumpy Old Ham said...

Those IP address logs do tell an interesting story...even when some people hide behind proxies there are still ways to ID the source...

Redeye80 said...

I hope one day before I die that the institution is proactive instead of reactive.  Good guidance, a couple of iterations of technology late.

DeltaBravo said...

Ell naw!

Veritas said...

Hopefully now, the owners (presumably midn or now officers) of some of those other idiotic midn-produced videos on YouTube that Phil R decried yesterday (but just were not as crass or vulgar as the cause celebre that prompted this memo but still not appropriate or just plain stupid) will pull those videos.

Kudos to the Supe and Dant for the prompt and positive response.  Though long overdue, maybe with the new administration, the ship of USNA is righting itself . . .

Grandpa Bluewater said...

'Bout time. New broom.....good (nice clean bit of correspondence, by the way).

Keep shoveling, better yet, divert a river.  Needs doin', and overdue.

The Usual Suspect said...

Thanks CDR.  BZ

Byron said...

And the Phibian knows who you are ;)

MR T's Haircut said...

I am humbled, I did nothing except what all here do, speak the honest opinion and let it fall where it may.

Phib is a force to be reckoned with.. the Howler Monkey's are just entertainment...

Good Job Phib!

Byron said...

Thet's funny, ah don' care who ya are, yessir :)

MR T's Haircut said...

I give credit to the USNA for quickly nipping this one and now on to the other troubles..

oh and bring back that oiled oblisk climb.. it builds team unity... 

Phil R said...

I really hope so.  The problem was...they were approved all the way through the chain of command.  All Spirit Videos must be approved at 4-star level, from what I understand.  Probably not wise to keep them on youtibe in perpetuity, however.

Anonymous said...

Who said you had to stay in to be an agent of change?  Not no more.... :)

Skippy-san said...

Nothng good will come from this-except a wave of follow on "big brother" regulations designed to ensure that only the content they want is posted. This is just the first round-wait till they start going after active duty folks for saying what they think in a private forum.

There is a dividing line between one's professional and one's private life and moralists who have tried to blur that line have created problems for the rest of us. This is none of the Navy's business.

Skippy-san said...

Well you don't have to worry about that with me-I just shoot my mouth off early and avoid the Christmas rush!

prschoef said...

Hold on a bit. The word "ladies", no matter what rank these women have, has a meaning. It does not apply to them.

LT B said...

I will give them the benefit of the doubt.  And maybe this is the step in the evolution that shows them how not to act to be considered ladies.  They made a mistake, they have or are paying for it and this will haunt them for a bit.  The academy must now reiterate the standard and make certain they meet it.  If not, no slack, they have a full count right now.  Whether they hit a homer or hit the showers is up to them. 

Dogger said...

Shipmates, I must be missing something here.  What I read is a missive from the PAO no less, "guiding" our future Navy Leaders to use a bit more discretion in the social blogosphere, and warning of possible fall-out if you committ felony-stupidity.  Between the Omnipotence of the FootBall Gawds and the and Diversity Kommissariat, it seems that none of our genteel Mids could ever possibly do anything wrong!  By their own admission this is not their first "whoopsie", so at the very least one would expect them to swing by the Supe's office (not the PAO) for a cup of coffee ("and don't bother to bring your cup").  This would be followed by a blood-curdling heart-to-heart to help these delicate flowers re-calibrate their focus. 

Anapolis is charterd to produce Naval and Marine Corps officers and leaders of our armed services and our Nation.  Our current "leaders" (civilian & military) have changed it into just another public college where all the students happen to wear the same outfits and have a really cool Summer program arranged for them. It has become a social services program based on quotas and special interest instead of a competitive selection of the best & brightest. 

Our Leaders need to set the moral & professional standard on the high bar again, ignore the Koom-by-ya crowd of social do-good misfits and challenge our Mids.  They can meet the challenge - in fact they thrive on it! - but by continuing to cut them slack and giving a second chance without consequences you foster derision and disrespect.  Cripes, my two-year-old has already figured that one out! 

So when does the Vocational School on the Severn become a Naval Academy again?

Phil R said...

I guess you did not take the time to read the other post and comments.  Conduct action is underway and they have spoken to Supe.

Dogger said...

Phil R - sorry, but my cromagnon brain missed the fiddly bits that implied /stated directly that "remedial action action/coffee-with-the-Supe" was inacted.  That being the case, BZ to all and a special tip o' the hat to the CDR and Mr. T's Haircut!

Warrant Diver said...

Is this the first written policy on "social media" the Academy has promulgated? They can't really be that far behind, can they? Phil R?

Andrewdb said...

Nothing wrong with what it says, only what it doesn't say.  Odd they don'tmention copyright infringement (honest, - I really don't even like the RIAA).

Is this consistent with the SECDEF's recent announcements on public statements? Maybe writing for UPI (like that COL who didn't like PPT) is different than FB or YouTube.

Phil R said...

Unfortunately, I do not know.  I do not work at USNA (I work in DC); I only spend off-duty time with some of the midshipmen where/when I can (mostly weekends). 

Phil R said...

Sorry if I was harsh.  Just so you know, there is significant specific counseling/conduct action going on, from what I have been told by the two women. Not complaining, just reporting on progress.

Skippy-san said...

When it brings back a real "shave their heads" plebe system. Not going to happen anytime soon.

C-dore 14 said...

When you cut away all of the excess verbiage that has been attached to it over the years the Mission of the U.S. Naval Academy is "To develop Midshipmen..."  Documents like this are merely the start of that process in one specific area.  You set the standards, communicate them. and enforce them.  Unless you take all three steps this will be just another meaningless piece of paper generated by the PAO.  Hopefully the Executive Department (or whatever they call it these days) and the Brigade Striper Organization have been put on notice regarding their roles in the process.

That they've taken this first step is encouraging, as are the rumors of "the reform", and Phil R's implication that these young women have "locked heels" in front of someone in authority.  (I know my session with the Ac Board Plebe Year helped me "get my mind right").  Mids being Mids, I suspect that it's only a matter of time until something else happens and am waiting to see how the new regime handles it.

C-dore 14 said...

I don't know.  I've always liked the "They done stupid.  Fry them!" approach  ;)

Tindril said...

I'd like them to add, " <span>The unfortunate result it that videos/photos posted to these websites remain viewable for a very long time to anyone with access to the internet - including your current (and future) family, relatives, friends, fellow service members,  future bosses and employer," and all terrorists, allies, and enemies (current and future).</span>

It's embarrassing to think of a person in X training school of X country searching for information about our country's military and/or officers and seeing videos like this one or one of the many that Phil R. posted. Laughingstock, indeed.

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Skippy,

I am disappointed that you didn't mention the Ramadan rush.  How insensitive and uninclusive.

QMC(SS) said...

DC Central, Scene...CDR Carpenter is the Man In Charge at the scene, there is NO additional assistance required.  There are NO injured personnel, damage is limited to personal egoes, school reputation and flag-officer integrity.  Fire is being overhauled.

Hmmmm....M...A...I...D...S...Check!

QMC(SS) said...

Not so sure they "Started" something so much as they (hopefully) FINISHED it.

LT B said...

Eh, I don't think that needs to be in there.  It is against the law.  You don't have to codify laws into midshipmen regs.  Don't break the law should be MidReg #1. 

LT B said...

Eh, I don't think that needs to be in there.  It is against the law.  You don't have to codify laws into midshipmen regs.  Don't break the law should be MidReg #1. 

Salty Gator said...

Phil, in what capacity?  Official, un-official, semi-official (National Naval Officer Association being semi-official)?

Salty Gator said...

This is like an e mail that you wrote long-long ago that will come back to haunt you.  When they show up at USS First Ship, someone will have a copy of it and it will circulate.  If they stay in, as shipmates, I wish them nothing but the best, because their best helps our fellow Sailors and ultimately the country.  If they don't stay in, well, they learned a lesson either way and we'll probably see Reverend Jackson blasting the Naval Academy.

sobersubmrnr said...

I like the part about "veterans and alumni." They've been catching a lot of flack from vets, including me.

bravozulu said...

What? Bring back Herndon? Silly, someone might get hurt! (Insert sarcastic eye-roll).

Never mind the fact that we're at a military school and more mids had to be taken to the hospital from last year's Color Parade than all the Herndon's I've ever seen combined....

C-dore 14 said...

Skippy-san, That system was barely alive when I went there.

MR T's Haircut said...

I cannot except credit for something I had no part in.. this is Phib's show.. I am only a spectator.. a Howler Monkey...

MR T's Haircut said...

wow, I would think a 4 star had better things to do.. can you Imagine Gen Patton, censoring his troops letter's home?  I cannot....

Anonymous said...

C-dore - And "when [you] went there" . . . isn't that called ancient history.  But sadly seriously, to the midn today, Ronald Reagan is considered ancient history, too.  Not bad company C-dore.

Veritas said...

The USNA PAO is cautious to point out it is guidance not policy.  Obviously, the lawyers were involved in this one.

Anonymous said...

It is no longer private when it has USNA on it.

The Usual Suspect said...

It is no longer private when it has USNA on it.  The last time I checked, the "N" was for Navy.

AnOldSailor said...

Skippy-san, If the young ladies involved were wearing U of M (or some other state school) shirts and weren't in any discernable way associated with the Navy, I'd agree with you.
However, since they were wearing something that links them to the Navy while in a Naval Acadamy dorm (which I certainly wouldn't recognize as such from the looks of it) they
in fact made it the Navy's business.

Think about it terms of showing up at a political rally or protest in uniform. That connects the Navy to the event. Hence the reason it is not allowed. 

Like it or not, being diligent with posting (firmly or loosely connected to the Navy) on social networks is a miniscule request. It is no different than any command they may serve
at in the future.

R/

Senior

C-dore 14 said...

Guest, Yep, you're correct.  Of course, Ronald Reagan was still Governor of California when I went there  ;)

C-dore 14 said...

BZ, Back in my day most of the Color P-rade casualties were suffering from the "brown bottle flu".

Phil r said...

Unofficial, Family outreach to mids to help them in the areas of life between the theoretical ideal living as midshipmen/future leaders and their current reality (and the things they really deal with).  Trying to help them by warning them about dangers (like this) and talking about learnng from mistakes (like I have), especially with drinking and other thorny issues (like sexual minefields). Opportunity exists and there is a great, great need.

C-dore 14 said...

Phil R, Good to hear and from what you've posted it sounds like you're doing your job and this/these young women are lucky to have someone who is interested in helping them them develop.  I hope they will learn from this experience.

Phil r said...

Thank you so much! I appreciate the positive feedback (especially after the last few days). 

I regret (but can't change) that I did not spend too much time with either of these specific young women over the past year. Ebb and flow of midshipman lives (and young peoples' lives). I have been truly amazed at what they (as a group) are really dealing with, even though I remember (mostly) what I was like (much more now).  They are not automatons, just like sailors or marines are not robots.  They are real people, all with real problems or challenges, who greatly desire to serve their nation. I am blessed to have the opportunity to spend time with them. I have learned much as well.

OK  Too much self-disclosure  ;)

DM05 said...

Don't know CDR Carpenter, but he's gotta be a busy man with a water hose or foam quickly putting out these fires. Nothing like a 24x7 news cycle, and our man at the front of the porch sharing the gleeful (sarc off) USNA news...

FbL said...

Well said, Old Sailor.  I work for a nonpofit with a strong online presence (those who know, know) and more than once I have paused before submitting something on Facebook under my own name because I do not want my politics or behavior to reflect badly on the organization for which I work.  It's not because of "big brother," but simply due to my recognition that what I do reflects on my bosses, et al.  It might not be right, but it's reality.  Those girls showed horrendously bad judgment in ignoring that reality in their own situation.

MR T's Haircut said...

Phil,

oh good god.. Sexual mindfields?  Really?  How the F**@ are they going to lead men and women in combat if we are so freaking worried about such crap?  Really?  Come on man.. you did your duty  enough.. I am going to freaking puke...

FbL said...

<span>Well said, Old Sailor.  I work for a nonpofit with a strong online presence (those who know, know) and more than once I have paused before submitting something on Facebook under my own name because I do not want my politics or behavior to reflect badly on the organization for which I work.  It's not because of "big brother," but simply due to my recognition that what I do reflects on my bosses, et al.  It might not be right, but it's reality.  Those girls showed horrendously bad judgment in ignoring that reality in their own situation.</span>

(And I've been even MORE hesitant to blog--even under this pseudnym--for the same reasons).

MR T's Haircut said...

<span>Phil,  
 
oh good god.. Sexual minefields?  Really?  How the F**@ are they going to lead men and women in combat if we are so freaking worried about such crap?  Really?  Come on man.. you did your duty  enough.. I am going to freaking puke...</span>
<span></span>
<span>Come on dude, I joined at 17 years old I figured it out real quick. these two are 19-20-21 years old  If you treat them like children they will never be adults.. MAN THE F*** Up!!!</span>

MR T's Haircut said...

Soory CDR you lost me with this crap.

MR T's Haircut said...

Sorry CDR Phil, you lost me with this touchy feely crap...

Byron said...

That's because he's going to treat them like adults first. If that doesn't take, they won't like the other option worth a damn.

Byron said...

Flame MTH? Good luck with that one.... Hope you have lot's of insurance and asbestos underwear.

C-dore 14 said...

MTH, As much as I like to agree with you, I'm kind of with Phil here.  This is the time for young people to learn what the Navy expects of you in areas such as drinking, learning from ones mistakes, fraternization, etc., and since, in my mind at least, USNA isn't doing such a great job of it it's good that somebody like Phil, who cares about these women as individuals, has stepped forward to do it.  They might even listen to him.

08grad said...

I just saw the video as a repost on youtube; i'm so disappointed. One of those girls was one of my plebes. we spent a lot of hard work trying to bring her up to speed. over plebe summer she would not participate in drill and used every opportunity to portray herself as a victim. Over the course of the academic year she had a few honor offenses. 

Curtis said...

I'm afraid I don't think so.  It's an excellent premise mind you.  Good for the soul and all that.

Rule #1:  Don't get caught.

We all broke the law.  Every single solitary one of us.

[not posted by an usna student, just a typical law abiding American]

Curtis said...

I support Phil R. 

When you want to talk about imposing the moral strictures of society on usna again, who's morals?  Oh dear, I'm a muslim and had an arranged marriage back when I was 11 why can't I attend?  Just food for thought.

You can see it now right?  Ellison will appoint one of the child brides and it will turn ugly very quickly.

Still, if we can arrange for departures from spec for football and basketball players why not for the rest of the crew.

Curtis said...

That's kind of a quandry.  It is one thing to suggest that all enter the maelstrom with fixed moral and ethical purpose and then to suppose that the very best way to accomplish this is to use pseudonyms.  I completely screwed up ages ago and went with my real name and you should just see the email addresses I've had over the years.  Cryptic they were not.  Don't think I every referred to my .mil addresses.

On the other hand back when I was on somewhat more focused duty I did use a pseudonym because just as you said, it was not my place to rabbit the USN.  I was savage when discussing the historical stuff but we didn't do much about the current world other than to savage the geography, air force, submariners, pilots and trivial stuff like that.  :)

Oh, and SEALS!

Veritas said...

"A few honor offenses . . . "  How many is "a few"?  (Is it like "I only had a few beers"?)  Also, do give details on the honor offenses -- I want to know the type of conduct that Rempt found acceptable in a midshipman.

Veritas said...

Byron - Can you be so sure the "other option" is even out there.  I recognize and appreciate that both the Supe and the Dant are new, and that they inhereited a mess.  But the history of the past decade does not leave one with a warm, fuzzy feeling.  I will, of couse, give the benefit of the doubt (for now) to the Supe and Dant, and that they understand and appreciate the it is suppose to be a military institution, not simply a free college.

LT B said...

Well, a mostly law abiding citizen. :)

MR T's Haircut said...

Phil, 

Flame away, I do not have a soft skin and I lack an even softer skin regardign our Navy.  First off, my "Man up" comment was not directed at you.. it was directed at those you counsel and it was meant Gender Neutral.  WHY is there an expectation that a Midshipmen or in other terms a "FUTURE OFFICER" would need more coddeling and touch feely crap disguised as "mentoring" then the Sailors in the Fleet they would presume to LEAD?

Further, to equate the misbehavior of Senior leadership, including those in Command at Sea with the antics of these idiot midshipmen is laughable.. REALLY?  Come on. .. Not even close.. you are cherry picking the argument.  You are showing a fundemental lack of understanding at the deckplate level by your feeble attempt at drawing a moral equivalency..  Sorry, I am throwing the bullshit flag on you...

MR T's Haircut said...

<span>Phil,   
 
Flame away.</span>
<span></span>
<span>I do not have a soft skin and I lack an even softer skin regarding our Navy.  </span>
<span></span>
<span>I admire your tenacity but you are now showing yourself as an apologist for motives known only to you by your defense of the indefensible.</span>
<span></span>
<span>First off, my "Man up" comment was not directed at you.. it was directed at those you counsel and it was meant Gender Neutral.  WHY is there an expectation that a Midshipmen or in other terms a "FUTURE OFFICER" would need more coddling and toucyh feely crap disguised as "mentoring" then the Sailors in the Fleet they would presume to LEAD?  
 
Further, to equate the misbehavior of Senior leadership, including those in Command at Sea with the antics of these idiot midshipmen is laughable.. REALLY?  Come on. .. Not even close.. you are cherry picking the argument.  You are showing a fundemental lack of understanding at the deckplate level by your feeble attempt at drawing a moral equivalency..  Sorry, I am throwing the bullshit flag on you...</span>

MR T's Haircut said...

And regarding Date rape and the like, I have been a Training Officer in a major Naval Aviation Technical Training Center.. I cannot even count with your hands and my Hands the number of allegations after many manhours spent investigating the facts to determine that the allegations were false....  here is a thought, Be consistent with your expectations and treat everyone as adults instead of your self described "child" and hold ALL accountable..

flame away big guy...

LT Rusty said...

Yeah, I was wondering the same thing myself.  'A few' is generally ((a few)-1) more honor violations than it's supposed to take to get kicked out, isn't it?  I mean, it was at The Citadel.  Does USNA not work that way?

Veritas said...

Honor Concept at USNA . . . under the past few Supe's it's become practically non-existant.  Misn commit multiple honor offenses. still retained (they just need more training on the importance of honor -- it's not the midn's fault -- it's the background from before the entered USNA - etc., BS, etc., BS

I'll refer to you a special report from the Crabtown Wrapper:
http://www.hometownannapolis.com/news/nav/2009/11/01-24/Academy-honor-cases-focus-on-redemption-not-expulsion.html?ne=1

That should help explain why the rank-and-file alumni feel they way they do.

justamid said...

Not sure why anyone's bringing up Rempt. He's long gone.

Notice the date on that article? That was from almost a year ago. In the meantime, we've completely changed the honor system (by an overwhelming brigade vote, mind you) and brought in a new Supe, Dant, and CMC. As with any change of command (especially all the senior leadership at one time and ESPECIALLY right after several ethical scandals), there's a whole new focus nowadays and it's-to borrow from Aladdin-a whole new world around here...trust me, 3 or 4 honor offenses doesn't fly anymore. A small part of me is tempted to say the pendulum has actually swung too far back the other way. We went from Fowler and "anything goes as long as the football team's winning" to a very by-the-book style of standards, standards, standards. I don't think it's bad, just different.

Trust me, though, people are getting kicked out at a much higher rate and for much less than they did under Fowler. Talk to any mid.

C-dore 14 said...

justamid, Hope what you say is true and continues over the long haul.  This old timer has a tough time wrapping his mind around second chances for folks found guilty of honor offenses and plebes that refuse to drill.

EMCM said...

"Guidance" and "...should not post"...give me a break! And the delivery man of this message is the PAO?! How about "order/regulation" and "....will not post" and the Commandant of Midshipmen sending the message! Clearly "this" didn't bother the leadership of USNA too bad, they'll just let the PAO take care of it...way to set the climate! This is the potential product sent to the fleet for my fellow CPOs and I to train...at least give me SOMETHING to work with. Anyone for a round of kumbaya? 

Curtis said...

I always gave every sailor one shot.  It wasn't free but they almost always got a second chance.  I found that I never had the stomach for zero tolerance.

LT B said...

it's a brave new world, sir and we are building the Global Farce for Good.  Standards are not necessarily important as long as they are flexible and make everybody feel good about themselves. 

FormerMid2010 said...

Warrant Diver,

This isn't the first guidance that's been released on "social media." I can't quote you exact numbers, but when I was a mid I recall emails similar to that nature sent out at least once a year. We also had a mandatory brief presented on the appropriate use of social media a year or two ago. As I recall, it was focused on demonstrating to the Brigade just how easily accessible photos on Facebook can be. The presenter did a decent job; as we all filed into Alumni Hall, a PowerPoint displayed embarassing (and to be honest, rather hilarious) photos of college students that we later found out were all taken from midshipmen profiles.

In my humble opinion, this isn't necessarily a failure of the Academy to properly educate on the correct use of social media. You can argue it's a failure of the Academy in other areas (and I'm not even going to wade into that discussion), but we were all aware of the dangers of posting anything to a social networking site.

Veritas said...

justamid, why bring up Rempt -- because while USNA was already moving towards the cliff, he gave the command of "flank emergency" to get it there as quickly as possible.

Of course, any effort to bring back some semblance of military life is going to feel like the pendulum has gone to the other extreme, but consider where its coming from.  I'm glad that 3-4 honor offenses doesn't fly anymore -- but I noted you didn't say 1 honor offense doesn't fly anymore.  Let me know when that happens.  What if a plebe lied to an upperclassman about whether he had shaved that day (even if the plebe probably didn't have enough facial hair to shave)?  When I was there, separated; today . . . .  Or how about lying re: PRT scores (and I don't care whether a 4/c or 1/c) . . .

What wasn't reported in The Capital story was the separation rate for honor violations.  I have the numbers at home, but it was something along the line that in 90/91 school year (or there about), of those who committed an honor violation, the separation rate was like 92% (a single midn was retained; all others were gone).  If the numbers had been published and tracked, one could have seen the decline that was happening -- by the early 2000s, the separation rate for honor violation fell below 50% and kept getting lower.

Why talk about Rempt -- because let's acknowledge that he, IMHO, lacked the courage to demand high standards; his first desire was to be liked by the midn (he wanted to be the midn's best friend, not the Supe) and so "anything goes".    What message is sent by the Supe puttering around the Yard in a golf cart with a little admiral's flag flying from it -- how cute.

Warrant Diver said...

FormerMid2010

thanks for your answer, and you said something that I think we've all been looking for someone to say-"we were all aware of the dangers of posting anything to a social networking site."
 That's certainly what I expect from any 18-25 yr old nowadays. I'm getting tired of these mids (and all people of this age, actually) being referred to as "children" or "young people". They are ADULTS, and should bear the responsibility that adults bear when they misbehave. They don't need handholding, they don't need costant mentoring, they need to be allowed to show their character so we can weed them out if the garden needs weeding.

Skippy-san said...

But that is just the point-the Hatch act already lays out those kind of proscriptions on conduct already.

The issue is that whole "represent the Navy"thing can get out of control. Like the CO who told me that I had to have his approval to publish an article in Proceedings. I ignored him and submitted my article anyway.

What is troublesome to me is that the people who will execute this guidance will go overboard-they always do.

Phil R said...

Fair statements, all. No disagreement.

Skippy-san said...

All I know is, if the drinking age in S.C. had not been 18-we would have been breaking the law every weekend! :)

C-dore 14 said...

LT B, When I was a Mid the phrase was, "The moral taught is don't get caught".  Of course what went along with it was if you did get caught you told the truth and took your punishment like a man.

Casey Tompkins said...

On the other hand, Skippy, now they can't play the "nobody told me / no one said I couldn't" game. They've been given very specific guidance & direction.

While there will no doubt be those who -as you say- go overboard, they would be doing so with any rule you hand them. It's in their nature. The only solution is to have no rules. ;)

fapco said...

that rack in the background of the video is unsat. 

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