Monday, August 22, 2011

With LCS, we have officially become the Soviets


Maybe it's Baghdad Bob. Sump'n.

Here is a problem; a free press relies on honest information from government sources and industry in order to produce stories. The press also should make sure and have the right reporters focus on the right areas.

When you have government sources living in PPTland, industry in full Bu11sh1t Bingo mode, and the press is full of restaurant and theater critics - I guess you git howlers like this from The Australian.
They carry three helicopters and special forces units with armoured vehicles that can roll off a ramp into action, while fast gunboats can be launched from the stern.
All at once? On bank holidays too? Does it slice, dice and julienne as well?

Good googly moogly. Where does one start? Three - counting Fire Scout - really? How much of a surprise for special ops forces using that ramp again? Define "gunboat."

Wait, it gets better.
... it is protected by Mk 110 57mm guns made by BAE Systems, plus missiles for air, land and underwater targets.

The warships' sleek silhouettes reflect their stealth technology, while the stable trimaran design suits the South China Sea, which is swept by typhoons every summer.
Fella, switch to decaf. It has yet to find a missile that can do anything ashore - nothing works yet. It has minimal AAW self-defense and even then only at short range, and no one has ASW missiles any more (ahhh, ASROC nukes; let me tell you a story ..... ).

Even if they did - they can't do all three at once. Ahem, back to now. The LCS going to the South China Sea is LCS-1, monohull. Don't you people Down Under have google? The one you are thinking about is the one on the upper-right of this post.
Experts say the ships are superior to any known Chinese vessel in their ability to combine anti-submarine, minesweeping, surveillance, reconnaissance and troop deployment missions.
On PPT, maybe.

OK. Next week let's put LCS-1 as now equipped on one side of Wake Island, and any of the
83 or so Chinese Houbei Class as now equipped on the other. We'll even play make-believe and give it, ahem, three Fire Scouts. Place your bets. If the LCS, as now equipped, can get pass the 8 C-802, I think the 57mm will best the 30mm ... so at least we have the PLAN in a gun fight ... I think.

I guess we have to repeat. LCS does not have an ability to conduct ASW. All that is in development and PPT-land - same with MIW. It can do recon, and put troops ashore in a permissive environment; so it has that for now. Check back in a year or two, we might have a partially mission capable mission module that is operational in some way.
... they are seen as a potent symbol of US might.
If symbols are overpriced, undermanned, underarmed, short ranged, and incapable of effectively changing its mission once it gets one with the equipment to do it - then sure, that last statement might be more accurate than the author thinks.

Military journalism fail.

I don't know who the reporter, Michael Sheridan, uses as his "experts," but dude - seriously - pop me an email next time.

(NB: Before the "butbutbut" brigade starts in comments. Pic above is from NewWars in 2010. When you take the cost of the LCS baseline model, add in 2-3 mission modules, logistical and infrastructure to support such above a "normal" multi-mission ship's deployment requirement along with the shorter ship life of LCS ... and you get .....)


Hat tip QMC.

40 comments:

LT B said...

I will put one of these:  http://news.yahoo.com/photos/chinese-navy-sovremenny-class-destroyer-ddg-138-taizhou-photo-111108801.html  up against 3 of our LCSs.

Byron said...

Heck, I'll put one of these against an even half dozen of LCS:

http://www.bendermaritime.com/artwork/originals/pages/OnthePicketLine_lg.html

phrank47 said...

I will take one row boat with a few Somali pirates onboard and a few ak and some rpg. Now granted my guys will have to have some fruit to sell to the crew on LCS to get close enough but once they do,

ewok40k said...

There was once a symbol of British Empire might in the area, it was called Singapore...
Pride precedes downfall...

ewok40k said...

(former) Soviets are offended, and righly so because compare Nanuchka or Tarantlul to LCS -  and dont start me on Sovremenny...

Old Farter said...

Jet Skis with RPGs. Easy day. It's Miller time!

Andy said...

Byron, you hit on one my favorite hobby horses right there! I started off on Career 1.0 as a 'shoe and I maintain that an "Improved Fletcher" or Sumner hull form could be the baseline design starting point for an effective in-shore fighting warship. Except it seems that's not what Big Navy wants anymore.

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Ain't no delusion like self-delusion. 

Beg to differ, though.  We became the Soviets some time ago.  With the Potemkin Color Guard at USNA, with Casey's lament about loss of diversity after the murder of 32 soliders by a Muslim Extremist that the Army promoted to Major.  With the CJCS lecturing us about how our personal beliefs should mimic his, or else we have an "integrity" problem.  With Admiral Titley's genuflecting to Global Warming and wasting hundreds of millions to combat a fabricated crisis of a political nature. 

And you see it in terms like "right-sizing" and "do more with less".  Where deliberately misleading terms are required to be used, and any dissent will be crushed and the dissenter labeled as a political undesirable. 

LCS is not the disease.  It is the symptom of the disease.  We have been the Soviets in some ways for some time now.  And not the fun kind, either.

leesea said...

Fletcher fully loaded, got a great model of one at JMHC

Cap'n Bill said...

Shucks! What ever became of the fully operational ASW weapon of choice--the FLETCHER with  DASH ? DD-779 won an E 'way back in 1969 using that gear.Even that with all its warts would be better able to claim any title of performance.

Old Farter said...

It just occurred to me that maybe the LCS is the new "Star Wars" and we will bankrupt the Chinese as they try to keep up. Anyone agree?   Anyone?   Beuller?

DeltaBravo said...

Would the USN fly those to the South China Sea on the magic carpet? 

I vote that someday it will be an entry in an article much like this. 

Unintentionally hilarious, indeed.

Surfcaster said...

I'll play!

Start here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steregushchy_class_corvette

Add 5 knots top speed, bigger avaiation facilities, modular in the sense of you can tailor one towards ASuW or ASW before BUILDING (MIW an entirely different class), right sized ship too. Nasty little bastard. Kick LCS's butt up down & sideways 'til Saturday, sadly.

Surfcaster said...

I'll play!

Start here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steregushchy_class_corvette

Add 5 knots top speed, bigger avaiation facilities, modular in the sense of you can tailor one towards ASuW or ASW before BUILDING (MIW an entirely different class), right sized ship too. Nasty little bastard. Kick LCS's butt up down & sideways 'til Saturday, sadly.

mack said...

Please no-one take that newspaper as any kind of reputable 'news' organisation or as any indicator for the intelligence level of Australia, despite it's name.

Salty Gator said...

Whenever I think of LCS, I think of Adam Sandler's album "They're all going to laugh at you."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-34Fdtg1dI

And his song, "Piece of $hit car."

Salty Gator said...

Whenever I think of LCS, I think of Adam Sandler's album "They're all going to laugh at you."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-34Fdtg1dI

And his song, "Piece of $hit car."

sid said...

<span>I'll play! </span>
<span></span>
<span>Me too.</span>
<span></span>
<span>And -as we are talking war here- never fairly.</span>
<span></span>
<span>And NEVER EVER according to some highly scripted .ppt scenario concocted by a blue blazer/khaki pants wearin' contractor...</span>
<span></span>
<span>So, LCS bubbahs...</span>
<span></span>
<span>Which one is the threat?</span>
<span></span>
<span></span>

Anonymous said...

The damn thing draws idiots to sing it's praises like a bugzapper draws skeeters.
Trouble is,  it isn't nearly as lethal.

LCS delende est.

Grandpa Bluewater said...

js-kit comment software delende est as well. 

DeltaBravo said...

GBW, I still think that "LCS delende est" would be an awesome ship's motto....

Anonymous said...

Pumping up the LCS so the Aussie Navy will buy them so more TV shows akin to "Sea Patrol" for their Armidale patrol boats can be produced.

CDR Salamander said...

I am thinking about shifting to Discus.

Open questions to all - what is the most user friendly comment system for the reader and/or which one would you want to see at CDRSalamander?

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Crayons and construction paper.  And scissors with the rounded edges.  But that is the Marine point of view....

phrank47 said...

I can't wait to see a LCS in a real wargame with a opfor that doesn't give it the 24 to 48 hours it needs to change out modules. The navy will say I am sure that it isn't REALISTIC to not have that time in a conflict zone. Have they ever heard of pearl harbor or 9-11. As with all the unmanned things that we are now beginning to depend on more and more we have come to expect that we will have totale EW control. Every time we field something that needs satelites or radio cmds to do whatever it is it does we are putting allot of eggs in one thing. I know it's scifi but Battlestar Galatica can be a reminder what happens when you trust your computers to much. What can't hit a LCS and it still function?

DeltaBravo said...

Don't give him paste. I think he's already told us he would eat it.

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Nope.  Donna Liberty ate paste and a blue crayon in art class in second grade.  And promptly threw up all over her desk, and mine.  Which caused me to throw up all over my desk and hers.  Forty years ago, and it still haunts....  and poor Mrs. McCarthy....

No paste for this Marine.  Or crayons of any color.

Surfcaster said...

Discus is (sure you know) what is used over at Gal's and it's marginal. This (JS) was better but it started stalling and stuttering badly a few weeks back.

So macht nights - stay or move, we'll hang out.

Surfcaster said...

For grins and giggles I loaded a not used in a while copy of Harpoon the other day. 5 LCS (1 ASuW with the no longer available IRL Netfires, and 2 SOF, plus 2 ASW) against one PLA version of the Sovremmeny destroyer. There was one remaining LCS when there was nothing left to say or do.

Yes, it is a game and yes, it is far from Real Life. But compared to PPT it is surprisingly telling.

ewok40k said...

most user friendly discussion system I've seen was called RL meeting, powered by b33r...

Stu said...

Does LCS make perfect toast too?

Stu said...

I found this to be one of your saddest posts.  From what we were to what we have become is simply sad.

ewok40k said...

Picture yourself in a boat on a river,
With tangerine trees and marmalade skies.
Somebody calls you, you answer quite slowly,
A ship with a Firescout eyes.

Cellophane flowers of yellow and green,
Towering over your head.
Look for the ship with the bulet holes,
And she's gone.

{CHORUS}
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Ah... Ah...

{VERSE 2}
Follow her down to a bridge by a fountain,
Where rocking horse people eat marshmallow pies.
Everyone smiles as you drift past the mushrooms,
That grow so incredibly high.

Newspaper taxis appear on the shore,
Waiting to film you away.
Sinking so gently beneath the waves,
And you're gone.

{CHORUS}
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Little crappy ship with sailors,
Ah... Ah...
... with apologies to the Beatles... I was just listening to a classick rock station and it has struck me how much the mood of the song reminded me of the powerpoint la-la land...

UltimaRatioRegis said...

We all live in a co-ed submarine,
co-ed submarine,  co-ed submarine,
We all live in a co-ed submarine,
co-ed submarine,  co-ed submarine,

Sorry.

Retired Now said...

While marching (never-ending marching !!) during Boot Camp,  we often sang the BEATLES Yellow Submarine vice calling cadence. 

(along with some songs that I wish were forgetable).   

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