Monday, June 13, 2011

LCS: no need for 1,000 words

A good friend to the blog sent this picture along as published at navy.mil. I don't know what more to say except what he did;
... the ship is looking pretty rough. It's not only the diesel exhausts and that plume of soot they spray across the beam, but just everything: Look at that weeping corrosion on the bridge windows, that big spill down the side from some kind of exhaust, and that weathered look across the superstructure generally... ...
BEHOLD (high res here)


This is a young ship - a ship that is the lead of her class - and look at her. She already looks like a worn out 50s era British destroyer still in the service of some 3rd World country.

You can't really blame the CO or the crew. They were given a sub-optimal ship manned at sub-optimal levels - a PPT slide made flesh, with the expected results.

LCS-1 looks like a tramp steamer off Ivory Coast and LCS-2 is so broke pierside in Mayport that her crew is on a first name basis at Singletons. It is all based on hope.

Hope does not bring victory at sea. Solid leadership, properly trained and equipped Sailors, and a well made ship bring victory. Hope? Yamato at Okinawa was hope.
“Both ships meet our operational requirements and we need LCS now to meet the warfighters’ needs,”
--- ADM Gary Roughead, 16 SEP 09.
I'm not mad or frustrated anymore, it just makes me sad. Sad that we have reached a point as an institution that a "workhorse" of our Fleet is this. We have misdirected our loyalty so much to personalities instead of the institution that no senior personnel come out in opposition. They don't come out due to fear - I know, there was a reason that while I was on Active Duty no one knew who I was. I get private comments all the time with a "I cannot say this in public, but I wanted you to know ... "

Nice Command Climate we have here.

So, there you go. LCS in a pic. Tells you a lot. We need to stop this rolling train wreck now. Should have killed the program a few years ago - but we should not throw good money after bad.

I'll repeat. As it is too late to kill it all - stop the run at 12-24 ships. License build one of the better true multi-mission EuroFrigates of a run of 12-24 until we have our own domestic design somewhere south of the Arleigh Burke Flight IV (nee DDG-X). Transfer LCS to USCG to function as medium endurance cutters 1-for-1 as the Bath-Built EuroFrigates come off the line.


Hope. The gentlemanly give-and-take that I have with some pro-LCS people remains strange. They acknowledge its shortcomings from cost to capability - but chant "hope" and "network" as if those things will fix physics, engineering, chemistry, and the sea. Amazing, and sad. I don't think we have seen a cult-like belief in a system since the B-36.
UPDATE: Sam Fellman over at The Scoop Deck is giving me a bit of title envy.

132 comments:

anon for a reason said...

They are meeting or exceeding all of the CNO's diversity goals.  I give them an A+.

Anonymous said...

<span>"I don't think we have seen a cult-like belief in a system since the B-36." Nice allegory - and so very true...</span>
<span>w/r, SJS</span>

Chuck Z said...

Jeebus.  The ships in the mothball fleet at Pearl look better than that thing.

FDNF Squid said...

Thanks for the BIW plug Sal, they are friggin' hungry right now as DDG 1000 is on the installment plan and we are in the 'wait and see' mode for the next round of Burke's.

The Iron Works could and should be building these soon, perhaps some like the JMSDF's Takanami class of DD...

Anonymous said...

Has anyone asked the Chiefs' community what they think about the current state of affairs, or has that once-venerable source of candor also been turned into an echo chamber? If so, then all is lost.

seattle fire said...

What makes you think the USCG wants them?

Anonymous said...

I predict a new camouflage paint job to incorporate the, er, stains and tramp stainer. er, steamer petina.

ex Fleet LT said...

Sal - Why the HELL would the CG want these? If they are as much of a CF/money pit they have neither the manning or resources to keep them.

Maybe she needs a new paint job, a la WW2

On a more serious note, can anyone with knowledge of this photo comment on the causes by percentage: design, manning, circumstances. Is this a different paint? Are there no BM's? Blame it on the diesels? There must be some explanation.

Salty Gator said...

"Even in the future nothing works!"  - Dark Helmet

Salty Gator said...

Yup.  Just like any other "diversity program."  balancing out the performers with crap based on some irrelevant metric.

Anonymous said...

There were parts of the SAN ANTONIO we couldn't paint because of the dangers associated with painting underway.  How much port time has LCS had lately? 

This is exactly what was said would happen.  You have a small crew, the Navy HAS to test this platform, there are a thousand priorities, and so where does hull maintenance fall into the hierarchy of priorities?   The Photo speaks as the good CDR points out.

YNSN said...

forgot to type my name in the log in...

Brickmuppet said...

They are fuel and maintenance hogs, fire traps and the LCS 1 class have dubious seakeeping. They also seem to collect dirt, which clashes with white paint.


What did the CG ever to you you that you would inflict these on them?
It was one of the Aviation Survivalmen wasn't it? They're always making blackshoes feel inadequate. Well stop taking it out on the cuttermen!

The CG leasrned their lesson when you mountebanks foisted the flivers and thousand tonners on us (and they didn't even suck!).  That ate the CGs budget for a decade.

Guest said...

A lot of the ships are looking pretty rough in SD.  Part of it is due to significant environmental restrictions from being able to do a fresh water wash down in port.  The deckhouse looks impossible to clean/paint either in port or underway.  

I am sure having the DG exhausts below the main deck were done for cost/weight reasons.  Great for an EDG, but not so great for ship service.  I imagine it sucks to be topside when the forward ones are running unless you are going 15 knots or greater.

All those design issues considered, it kind of looks as you would expect.  

ewok40k said...

I have an idea: give them away to Iranian Revolutionary Naval Guard  as a goodwill gesture... they will be trapped in spending $$ for maintenance forever - or at least good few years, instead of buying something that actually can fight!

spek said...

the exhaust marks can be scrubbed off, but the closer you get to the orifice, the less it is soot, and more it is acutal burnt on charring, and must be painted over.  the only way around the soot/burn marks is to surface prep and paint every 6 months, or add an extension pipe to the exhaust port to offset it from the hull a foot or two, but that is unwieldy.  a suggestion was made to paint a black section of the hull to correspond with the marks, but it never went anywhere.

the superstructure is aluminum.  can't paint it.  should the crew or a contractor scrub it with a greenie until it gleams?  this is what aluminum looks like. 

Guest said...

Thanks for correcting my assumptions.  - Guest.

Aubrey said...

At first I thought this pic was associated with the story at USNI about sneaking aboard the mothball fleet...

CAPT JAP RET (deceased?) said...

Are those intake vents above the bridge?  If so, I would not want to be on that ship in rough seas when invariably water goes over the bridge and into the vents.

Cap'n Bill said...

"In my Day" US Navy ships and their crews were admired by seamen the world over. Service in the Fleet was perhaps hard but fair.  Also somewhat simple by today's  social standards.
We all benefited from the reasonable coordination of duty,ship and crew.  Our leaders  had won their gold at sea in demanding positions.  

From a distance it seems to me that the men of today's Fleet must make far too many compromises in order to get the job done.   No seaman of my day would have been proud to serve on that ship.   

Squidly said...

Thought we could paint aluminum...at least, that's what happened on the OHPs...not that I encourage a crew of ~50 to paint a ~2500 ton ship while underway...then there's another question:  does the LCS even have a paint locker?

P.S. Wallace said...

I'm reading Reynold's "The Fast Carriers" right now. Did you know that in the middle of the biggest shooting war ever that they were apparently arguing tactics, strategy, and Naval direction (especially the level of prominence Naval Aviation should take) in the pages of Proceedings--and not in the abstract either, but in a way that meant person A would lose a chance for sea command if the advice was followed, and person B would get it; and that method C would be adopted, and method D would not?

In the middle of a shooting war. Back in a time when letters home were censored. But in Proceedings they are apparently "tearing" into each other. Awesome.

That Navy had its own issues (I don't think the aviators were nearly as squared away as they thought (see John S. McCain, typhoon, Pacific), or could have done it alone without men like Spruance and Nimitz, and I'm not sure how squared away the Atlantic Fleet ever got compared to the British and Canadian levels of ASW performance)--but at the end of the day that Navy could fight. Are we that Navy still?

Anonymous said...

A lot of this is on the mark, but not all of it. There is a treatment on the superstructure of LCS-1 that is being confused as corrosion. It actually looks even stranger close up.

Hard to tell in the pictures, but if you look closely you can see grooved treatment in the steel superstructure. I have notes on what they did, but would love to hear a professionals take.

The Usual Suspect said...

LCS looks to have the same housekeeping as the Polish and Russian, no disprespect to the Poles and Russians, trawlers that used to call on Coos Bay after they would have a collision while clearing the sea floor with their hair nets.  Pretty shoddy looking POS.

Old Farter said...

I'd hate to be on the boat crew if the forward exhaust is putting out. I wonder if they have to secure that exhaust during boat ops.

prschoef said...

I note tat she also seems to have no flagbag or signal lamps. Did I miss them?

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

Me I ain't mad, ain't sad.  The fix is clear.  LCS delende est. 

QMC(SW)(ret) said...

I noticed the same. Where is the hotel flag?

spek said...

not really.  "hybrid sailors" don't paint.

spek said...

that's diesel generator exhaust, not propulsion exhaust.  they can run whichever gensets make the most sense during ops

ewok40k said...

at least from the ashes of B-36 trainwreck rose B-52...

Anonymous said...

Hilarious to see how scary change is to a bunch of trembling old farts...

Anonymous said...

BTW, those Italian SSDGs are so iffy the exhaust stains should be a welcome sight.

GBS said...

A B-36 carried more firepower than this thing!

leesea said...

Great replacement plan.  Buy a foreign design, tweak it, put it out for competitirve bid and then build it at BIW the only good destroyer yard left.

DON'T even foist these high priced beasts on the USCG

leesea said...

USNS ships have smaller crews and MUCH better hull coatings.  But they do rely on shoreside for re-coating

CDR Salamander said...

Please --- enlighten us about this "change" thing of which you speak.  We "old farts" in Gen X really don't understand the concept.

Examples.  Please.  All these advanced graduate degrees from the late 90s and early 00s just leave our minds uncapable of linear thought.

Use single syllable words if possible.  We wait for your wisdom.

Anonymous said...

Tramp steamer petina, nyuck, nyuck, nyuck.

Anonymous said...

This is not so much change as degradation

DeltaBravo said...

Examples of "change" that can make "old farts" "tremble" on the high seas:

Dentable hulls
Undermanning (err... optimal manning)
Holes in the hull
Rust
Rust
Did I say rust?

All of these are technically change.  Hopey Changey!  Yes, we can!!!!

DeltaBravo said...

I really hope Poland has found a good use for you, Ewok...

pk said...

sounds like the diesels that were in the aluminum mine sweepers that replaced the old woodies.

C

pk said...

are you saying that LCS-1 & Lcs-2 are prime candidates for sinkex operations?

DeltaBravo said...

Here's a cute song maybe her crew could do one of those little YouTube videos to...

pk said...

yes but by murphy's law the one with the best location with crap out first.

also see the fun and games had by all with the various relocations (all six of them as i remember) before they found a good location for the forward emergency diesel exhaust on Tarawa LHA1........

C

pk said...

whaddaya mean "can't paint aluminum?"  in the past USN had many classes of ships that were aluminum from the main deck up. they painted that so thick that sometimes the grease zerts on the bearings on winches disappeared.

AHHHHHHHHaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

must be part of that modern electronic bs.

C

Retired Now said...

Paint. =. Weight

It,s. Way. Overweight. Already !

Navig8r said...

Coast Gurad (or any FMS, for that matter) couldn't afford to keep them up, with all the high-priced automation built in.  I say keep a handfull of LCS 2's for minesweeping, since the rest of our minesweeping capability is going away.  Then build a couple dozen Euro-Corvettes.  Multi-mission, small manning, ready to do whatever with no module swap-outs.  Israeli Saar class Corvettes come to mind, built in the US by NGSB at a couple $M each.  75 men, 10 foot draft, 35 knots if you need them.

Retired Now said...

There are no heavy seas nor high winds planned for LCS ops. No OLD THINKING allowed !!

pk said...

back in the day:

the greenies inflicted by regulation the use of all non waterbased paints in the southern california area. now you gotta remember that ships take literally acres of painted surface to "preserve them".

well the waterbased paints back then required that the surface be dry to paint on and for the paint to adhere. in southern california in the months of may, june, and july we have the weather pattern called "June gloom". that is night and morning low clouds that are in actuallity fog. what it amounts to is that there is a window of about 6 hours betweeen the period when the hull has dried out (about 4 hours after the fog has burned off) and the new evening fog rolls in. now the paint guys said that you could paint with about 5% moisture on the surface but "NO SALT RESIDUE" which meant that the stuff deposited by the night time fog had to be washed off concidently with the morning burn off...........

mix that in with six seperate layers with individual drying rates.....

remember "WE MAKE OUR DATES".

no wonder the sandiego people would walk down the pier in the morning and find patches of paint laying on the pier that were not square yards but square acres.

have you noticed that now a tiny number of companies build things that call for extensive painting are still in existance in southern california. most heavy industry has left the area because of the air quality regulations among other things.

c     

Retired Now said...

Lcs 3 has fixed all these minor problems. It has sea trials in AUGUST.

pk said...

whats the interval on USNS between bottom sand blasting and repainting and is it done in the united states or environs?

C

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Hey Guest,

A Littoral Combat Ship that the Navy admits is neither built for, nor can survive, combat in the littorals is definitely some change that frightens. 

Unless you wanna go dashing into the littorals and engage multiple enemy weapons systems you can't detect until they start shooting.

How long can you tread water?

James said...

We dont need the Corvettes so much as frigates. Just plain old unsexy frigates.

And no offense but from my view the Workhorse of the Fleet combat wise looks like the Burkes. When you cant do without them it shows.

Byron said...

Gosh, I thought that "treatment" on the house side was Kevlar bolted to it. Tell me if I'm wrong...because I found out what it was two years ago. FFGs had the good sense to install their Kevlar on the INSIDE of the ship...

Byron said...

Nice snark!

Clarkward said...

Delicious sarcasm in that post! :)

If it's not sarcasm...  'Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia'

spek said...

paint on naval ships is less a cosmetic issue than a preservation issue.  i should have said, "No need to paint aluminum".  you can, but except for appearances here, it serves no purpose - just adds weight, like the man said.  and once you paint it, then you have to maintain the coating...

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

Aye, and disregarding the bomb bay completely.

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

Naw, the scrap value of the aluminum is important.  Beer cans, house siding, fry pans, their factories are hungry.

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Absurdly stringent environmental regulations put in place by anti-capitalist, anti-military environmentalist nut jobs have a detrimental effect on keeping businesses in a geographic area?  Who suspected such a thing?

Old Farter said...

Love me some Split Enz. They never quite caught on in the US, though. Crowded House, their off-shoot, did a little better.

Byron said...

Bare aluminum+ship full of electronics+salt water/air medium= a LOT of "exfoliation". Alminum doesn' rust, per se, at least not as you think of it. It either turns in "snowballs" (of white powder) or it begins to delaminate like crazy, especially stress areas.  If it was my ship and my money, the damn thing would be painted.

Don't believe me? How many of you SWOs have had your aluminum superstructure ship have a fan room gutted because the aluminum was shot to hell?

LT B said...

Same guys basically, funny thing is in 87, on the MTV awards, I actually remember this, Crowded House was given the new group of the year award.  We laughed as it was Neil and Tom Finn, the same guys that formed Split Enz. 

As for the LCS, whenever I am in Mayport, I just look at it welded to the pier and shake my head.  I ponder the metrics of the crew's racial makeup and how they have improved the performance of the nonexistant mission modules.  I pray we get a CNO who has actual serious goals and concerns.  I'm also curious as to the follow on jobs of the last two CNOs.  We shall see.

FCC said...

Just like with the clusterfark PT-uniform rank and file "official" photo, I'm still not sure whether I should feel proud or ashamed that nobody thought to commit 20 minutes to photoshopping the pic to look a little less ... embarrassing.  Given all the Soviet-style "productivity is up!" nonsense, one would think they'd've taken the *full* playbook.

FCC said...

CDR -- PleasePleasePlease indulge me with an IP area of Youngy McI-Love-Change.

FCC said...

They just post the Helo Ops on their Facebook status.

Anonymous said...

If you gather all the LCS supporters in one place, and if bull$hit was brass, you would have a very impressive marching band!

W2 said...

Byron - AMEN!  fan room, stbd side main deck, just off O country head.  On both the FFG's I served on that place was a pit.

Retired Now said...

well, Clark.  


I  "had"  a great post for right here.   But after I typed it up and hit   "POST",  

the wonderful  blog system,  said it exceeded too many characters and it promptly deleted the entire post !!!

Ratz.....   This Cdr Salamander site used to simply give you a chance to make your post smaller without auto blog entry deletions.

Very disappointing.....  

BUTCH said...

1  - 12-24 LCS hulls is 10-22 too many.

2 - What did the Coasties ever do to you that you'd want to stick them with this piece of krep?

BUTCH said...

<span>If you gather all the LCS supporters in one place,</span>

and you called in an Arc Light strike ...

sid said...

But hey!

It can throw up a wall of water 15 whole feet high!!!!!!

Now, how cool is that for the billion $$$$ price tag?!?!?!

sid said...

That boat looks like total crap.

And yeah. Harsh as it may be...

The LCS bubbahs deserve the blame.

Time to stow all that, "look how cool we are on on our cool ship" attitude.

Call it wrap. Stop the build today...And live with the gap while we can.

Faintfuzzy said...

Give 'em to the CG???

Sal, make sure you don't need any help when you go out on your boat...We don't care for insults like that at all.

What is that little bump on the bow?  It's right where you'd put a gun...and yes, the NSC has a bump there too.

SCOTTtheBADGER said...

There are countries out there that still have REAL LCSes given to them in the 1960's by the US Government. Time to say again, what will happen when one of these mistakes goes up against an LCS from some 3rd world country?  3"/50s and multiple 40mm Bofors against one 57mm.  The USN will lose a ship and it's crew. 

SCOTTtheBADGER said...

Maybe it's Zimmerit, so the Russian Tank Riders cannot stick magnetic charges against the hull?

Anonymous said...

We paint aluminum hulled, diesel powered crewboats in the gulf of mexico, and the soot problem is handled on most(especially the Chouest ones) by-you guessed it- painting the area around the exhaust black.

Can't do that though, not "transformational", plus it's something uneducated coonasses have been doing for 15 years, so no way to get funding for a $$$$tudy on the matter....

Byron said...

I think the exact words were, "anti-spalling, fragmentation resistant composite"....

Byron said...

"uneducated coonasses"


I resemble that remark! Heck, I are one!

sid said...

and the soot problem is handled on most(especially the Chouest ones) by-you guessed it- painting the area around the exhaust black.  


The Soviets had the good sense to paint that aft sections of the Poti class hulls black for the same reason...

sid said...

<span>What kind of speed is she making in that pic?  
 
Tell me again why this LCS has to go 40+ kts????  
</span><span></span>

Tom Mowry said...

Agreed. Stop this Travesty at 12 ships or less. We need a Frigate way south of the Burkes. Lets look at what the real duties of a Frigate are and go from there. I hate to say it because I feel old when I do, but it is time to get back to the basic missions; escort, patrol, gunfire support, plane guard, screen duties. I remember going to a Perry from a Kidd class and thinking I was slumming, but when it came down to it the Perry was a good overall platform. This is just crap.

Grumpy Old Ham said...

I wouldn't exactly call the Peacemakers a "trainwreck"...they did in fact keep the USSR at bay while the -47 and -52 were working out their own sets of kinks...

(donning Nomex)...and some of y'all need to let go of the "Revolt of the Admirals" thing...it ain't the Air Force that's ruining your fleet, anymore.

LT B said...

Let's send the LCS over to the SCS to defend Vietnam from China.  The irony amazes me.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AS_CHINA_US?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-06-14-06-28-50

At least the crews onboard the Chinese ships will die laughing as they watch the LCS run out of fuel and then rust away as it sits there DIW.  So to please Sun Tzu, we could win the war w/o firing a shot

G-man said...

Pathetic.  Hoepfully NavSea 00 agrees.  It needs a gun.  A real gun.  but a real gun would probably shake the bridge windows out when it fired.  Sell them all to the Central African Republic Navy.

Salty Gator said...

Guest, I love when a bunch of children, fresh into the Navy, defend their admirals as infallible Gods.  Spend more than 5 seconds in something more than just a PAO tour. If you never bothered to study Naval history outside of the bare minimum put forth through NROTC or the Academy, then you don't know squat.  Your GMT will never tell you why major deck guns have played a huge part in every surface battle from Trafalgar to Jutland and beyond to modern times.  Your GMT will not tell you how important it is that your ship be able to absorb damage and have enough crew to simultaneously fight the damage and fight the enemy.  Read your history.

Anonymous said...

What was it that Chesty Puller said to his "Raggety-Ass" Marines near the end of their Guadalcanal "deployment?"

"We look this way for a reason!"

Anonymous said...

Speaking of Guadalcanal, James Hornfischer's latest book, "Neptune's Inferno: The U.S. Navy at Guadalcanal" is worth it at ten times the price. A terrific read!

Reconsider said...

Okay....she doesn't look great.  Lets ask why?  My personal opinion is the statements made by those who are Naval personnel need to bear merit here.  But, they also deserve some serious questioning with respect to accountability.  Having served, I can tell you that utilizing excuses and exhonerating the crew and CO for the condition of this ship makes me angry.   It is the crew and officers of a ship that bring it to life and take pride in its appearance and its outward reflection.  Perhaps there are tempo challenges that prevent such upkeep and maintenance but these things never stopped the perservation responsibilities of the crew and important facet we call Navy Pride.  At the end of the day, I don't ask the CO or the crew of this ship doing if they are performing there duties in making the "workhorse of the fleet" one that looks respectable and prideful.  What are they asking for?  An auto-cleaning function that lets them sit on their tails and have it do it itself.  Better yet, why don't they procure an automatic ship washing station so all they have to do is drive her through the quazi car wash.   The political banter on here astounds me.  The picture of this ship is a direct reflection of the crew and officers that run it.  They need to answer the call and seek assistance in solving this dismal appearance of a very capable warship.  Argue what you will about whether we need LCS or not....put please don't ignore the obvious when it comes the material condition of this ship.   

Scott Brim, USAF Partisan said...

See the attached photo of my latest updated concept for an LCS tender -- the USS Tender Mercy -- which now incorporates an optional LCS hull scrubber system.

Based upon the emerging requirement for frequent cleaning of a deployed LCS hull, this new feature adds even more utility to its already-existing LCS refueling capabilities and its LCS crew maintenance and repair facilities.

pk said...

once upona a time california had a governor referred to as Moon beam XXXXX.

an oil company wanted to build a tanker berth on land that would be made by dredging an area of the current harbor.

they had hearings galore in which the greenies set forth many many weird and interesting schemes for spending that companies money in order to smooth the way to success.

another company very quietly built a new tanker berth, they moved an ancient wooden airplane to a place near an ancient oceanliner and built it on the space left free. the old berth (that they used the existing smog permits for) was turned into a scrapiron pier. in order to cover the greater pollution for the larger tankers they bought and scrapped out the Macmillian Ringfree Oil Company, a grimy little specialty lube oil refinery covering about a square block that was built more or less the second day after the first oil strike in signal hill. all done legally and above board but while the screaming about the first tanker berth was at its height.

on opening the berth the second company gave the first the "high sign" and the first announced that they were abandoning their project and blamed moonbeam for it totally. made the usual dire predictions of price rises at the gas pump......... this resulted in about a months finger pointing.

gov. moonbeam screamed that he had been f$^*ed, as he well and truly had been, however if he had not gotten enmeshed chasing fruit flys or spent so much time in the coastal enclaves, one of thier villages needed and idiot, he wouldn't have been caught.  

now we have him back again, where're the fruit flys when we need them.

C

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

"Very capable ship"?! You really have to give up drunk blogging.

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

Got me twice yesterday. Grumble, mumble, grump.

pk said...

i belong to the school of the fewer the number of seachests the better.

one of the group mentioned that the dssg's  were erratic in operation. could it be that they are being choked by water comming in those side discharges.

remember diesels don't like saltwater comming up the exhaust (flapper valves do let a certain amount of water through when they close or flows insufficient to close them) and if they have an exhaust driven supercharger ANY salt water will destroy them.

of course the "great ones" that designed this boat could never be called on to talk to the old pig boat sailors about this.


C

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

I am available for discussions. If they're up to it.

Grandpa Bluewater. said...

No, they are too busy ruining the Air Force. A much smaller task.

pk said...

perhaps one of the clan that walks down the pier every morning beside one of these monsters might look down in the water and comment to us whether there is any sign of barnacles or seagrowth on the hull.

it would seem to me that those critters could really cut into the speed on these things.

C

Alo said...

Why inflict these floating trash barges on us Coasties?

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Gator's right.  The only infallible Gods are Marine Artillerymen.  8-)

Retired Now said...

What is lots of fun, is about 3 hours before getting underway, Lcs lights off 3 of her too-small SSDGs, and soon shifts from shore power to ships power. Then.....

Whether you are in CIC or passing thru the mess decks, you get to breath wonderful diesel fumes, which are quickly pulled inside the ship while it is still tied up. Also your neighboring ships love breathing your exhausts, too! Is it too late to copy France Singapore, south African navies and exhaust below the waterline ? You know, stealthy and all that modern design stuff.

Anonymous said...

NAVSEA PMS or PEO-xxx (fill in a number)' needs to hire you quickly. Your design is leaps and bounds better than NAVSEA has done recently: DDG-1000, LHA-6, LCS-2 class, LPD-17, and the Most disgraceful attempt of all: LCS-1 class.

Your proposed design is at least as efficient and more practicable than those done in the past decade.

SCOTTtheBADGER said...

He didn't specify just what it was very capable of.

SCOTTtheBADGER said...

And Badgers

UltimaRatioRegis said...

Naturally!

Anonymous said...

No seaman--there's your trouble! Where are the non-designated Seamen Schmatzes of the world? You can't preserve and maintain without a deck department.

Whoa Nellie said...

Doooh! Forgot to type in my login...

yeah said...

The ship is going into drydock next week. It's alot easier to clean it there.

sid said...

These ships are intneded to be forward deployed for extended periods...Right??

So. Where is you shipyard in the Gulf of Oman?

oh wait...

I know of a perfect locale...

I know things are "different" now...And ships names don't matter and admirals hitching rides in seagoing versions of geriatric campionetas are acceptable practices for the properly diverse "Global Force For Good"...

But the fact of the matter is, iof you wantg that ship to be part of a squadrond that "influences" folks on the far side of the world...

Then you'd better figure out a way to keep her squared away without a nearby yard.

sid said...

Especially after a few months in the Bight of Biafra or some other godforsaken place.

FCC said...

Scene:  XO's Stateroom
XO:  CSO, I just reviewed your departmental quarterly report.  What's with the 75% RAR?
CSO:  Well, sir, a lot of checks were lost.
XO: Why?
CSO:  Because they were re-scheduled for next quarter.
XO: Why?
CSO:  Well, because we had so much fantastic liberty last quarter ... but we'll be U/W a lot next quarter, so it will be easier for the guys to do their maintenance.

Retired Now said...

Top SECRET now Declassiifed: LCS are all being covertly converted over to run on COAL !

Yes, it's finally happened. NAVSEA is attempting to divert attention from their pitifully armed littoral COMBAT ship, by Going GREEN.

But do not let them know that coal is not a renewable source of propulsion power.

So there. Now the cat is out of the bag and we all know why LCS looks so filthy.

sid said...

<span>Amazing, and sad. I don't think we have seen a cult-like belief in a system since the B-36.</span>
<span></span>
<span> Snoort!!!!!</span>
<span></span>
<span>(or maybe I should weep...)</span>
<span></span>
<span>The descent in abject absurdity accelerates:</span>
<span></span>
<span>Naval Sea System Command's Littoral Combat Ship Price Analysis Team won Competition Excellence Acquisition Team of the Year for its LCS proposal analysis leading to the largest naval ship procurement in four decades. </span>
<span></span>
<span></span><span></span>

sid said...

<span>Kinda reminds me of a busted up sewer line...  
 
<span>The goo just keeps bubblin' up....</span>  
 
<span>Chuck Goddard, a former program executive officer for ships (PEO Ships)</span> for the U.S. Navy's Naval Sea Systems Command (NAVSEA), has been named president and chief executive of Wisconsin-based Marinette Marine, builders of the LCS 1 Freedom-class littoral combat ships (LCS).  
 
</span><span>There should be a law that prohibits employment with a firm over which a gent like this had program authority for a minimum of 5 years.</span>
<span></span>
<span>Or, if they insist...then they give up their retired pay.</span>
<span></span>

Grotopotamus said...

And yet the Invincible goes to scrap for...office furniture. Sad, sad, sad.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/8577173/Sad-end-for-the-pride-of-the-Royal-Navy-HMS-Invincible.html

Salty Gator said...

wait a tic.....I thought that Ohio State was a reputable school?  Coast Guardsmen went there?

pk said...

the deck gang was the traditional source of motivation. once one of them got strikered out they would do anything to stay out of it,

things like: not missing ships movement, laying off the goofballs, staying out of the brig, getting to watch stations on time, not sleeping on watch........

Old Farter said...

It will be interesting to see where Mullen and Roughead land.

Retired Now said...

MARINES
Muscles Are Required
Intelligence Not Essential , Sir.

ARMY Ain't Really a Marine Yet.

8-)

UltimaRatioRegis said...

"Muscles Are Required"

Yep!  Cuz sometimes you just gotta crush 'em!

Squidly said...

Worse that the Stew-Stevensons?

Getyourfactsstraight said...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Littoral_combat_ship

Ahem.  Google the images for LCS Freedom and LCS Independance, and you'll realize the provided image isn't an LCS.  The wired.com article about the LCS corrosion problem led me here, but i'll have to point this article out to them as well as being misleading.

Wstr said...

Wait...what?
'Google the images for LCS Freedom and LCS Independence' - check that was easy (only need LCS-1 USS Freedom for comparison with the posted image) 
'You'll realize the provided image isn't an LCS' - sorry my eyes aren't what they used to be, so you're really going to have to help me realise here!

You have read that wiki page down to the bottom have you? Here's a better angle for easier comparison (from the dedicated LCS-1 page accessible from your link) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:USS_Freedom_(LCS_1).jpg

Wstr said...

<span>Wait...what?  
'Google the images for LCS Freedom and LCS Independence' - check that was easy (only need USS Freedom for comparison with the posted image)   
'You'll realize the provided image isn't an LCS' - sorry my eyes aren't working right, so you're really going to have to help me realise here!  
 
You have read that wiki page down to the bottom have you? Here's a better angle for easier comparison (from the dedicated LCS-1 page accessible from your link) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:USS_Freedom_(LCS_1).jpg</span>

CDR Salamander said...

You need to take a RECCE quiz there shipmate.  In the likely event you don't know what that means - the pic in this post comes fron navy.mil.

Take it up with Gary.

sid said...

<span>but i'll have to point this article out to them as well as being misleading.</span>

Guess GYFS is oblivious to the sad state of the Freedom in that pic....

Byron said...

Not to mention his facts are a lot of things but they ain't straight... 8-)

Byron said...

In a ton of money and stock options?

Redeye80 said...

I'll have what ever you are drinking 'cause it must be powerful stuff, it make ya half blind.

guest said...

I can understand the confusion, events overtook this post and the LCS in the Dangeroom article is actually worse off than the visual problems with the LCS shown here.  Aiie.

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