The President announces a nuanced AF-PAK Strategy (a post I am working on for later this week) - as US forces continue to shape at the Tactical level in an exemplary manner.
Well --- then Biden weighs in with something that does but one thing; provides comfort to the enemy and tells our friends that they had better look towards "Plan B."
Speaking on NBC’s “Meet the Press” on Sunday, the master of subtle diplomatic messaging declared that on July 2011 the U.S. really will begin to leave the Afghan theater. “It will not be a token amount” of troops leaving, Mr. Biden said, adding that “We’re going to be totally of there come hell or high water by 2014.”Yes, a retreat under fire will be both hell and high water.
Watch the next in line to The Presidency yourself.
Just to make sure that everyone knows we plan to retreat; the Voice of America in Afghanistan has translated this into Pashtu (I think) and Dari. Nice.
Well - if that is it; slow trickle summer 2011 and pell-mell retreat in 2014, then what are we actually doing?
Well, if I were still in the business, with this Direction and Guidance there is one simple thing to do - with what you have try your best to create the best of possible conditions on the ground before you leave. Once you do that - then you have hope. Hope isn't a plan, but sometimes it is all the politicians give you. Good luck guys - I don't envy your COA Development.
Not since the 93rd Congress have we seen such irresponsible behavior towards engineering defeat.
AFG was "my war" not IRQ. I remember talking with my parents in mid-'07 when IRQ was so dire and AFG seemed so OK to those reading the press. My mother especially was shocked when I told her that it was AFG that worried me, not IRQ. The reason was that the solution to AFG was the 8-yr olds in the classroom today that we hoped to have literate in 10 years so they could re-form a civil society. I didn't feel that we could have the patience required to see it through multiple administrations. The AFG know to look for any sign of weakness so they can make plans accordingly. They trust no one - and for good reason.
I don't know how much more we can advertise weakness than this. If I were Tajik, Hazara, or Uzbek and did not have the money or inclination to emigrate - I would be rearming with a passion with plans to eliminate all Pashtun pockets in my area at the first chance I can between now and 2014. If I were Pashtun, I wouldn't get withing 10 yards of anything associated with the USA/ISAF/Afghan government.
Those are the pragmatic things to do. Not the right thing to do perhaps, but the pragmatic if you live in that neighborhood. I would say that if not already, if we follow through with 2011's initial retreat, over 51% of AFG will feel the same.
Well, just be happy this crew wasn't in power in '07. Remember, Biden was the one that thought the solution to IRQ was to cut it into three parts while a quasi-civil war was going on. Brilliant that was.
Back to AFG though; if you aren't in it to win - then why are you there?
59 comments:
How "Diverse" do folks look when they have been mutilated into the fallen on the battlefield?
Just askin'
More on that particular battle here....
The British Army learnt a number of lessons from this sorry episode. One was that the political officers must not be permitted to predominate over military judgments.
hmmm
But hey!
We gotta military that is Diverse To None!
(at least the parts that are not outsourced)
And national leaders like Biden Kerry Pelosi Reid!!!...
And King O of course
Makes yah proud don't it?
I have always felt and expressed that no one should be named "Commander in Chief" without having first served in the military. I now wish to extend that sentiment to all V.P.s as well. What a PUTZ! God willing they will all be out of office come 2012.
<span>I have always felt and expressed that no one should be named "Commander in Chief" without having first served in the military. I now wish to extend that sentiment to all V.P.s as well. What a PUTZ! God willing they will all be out of office come 2012.</span>
"When wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains
An' the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to yer rifle, an' blow out your brains,
An' go to yer Gawd like a soldier!"
Or, for 2014
"When Biden directs us to turn out the lights,
Jest hope you don't die in the last of the fights,
For the service is now about Diversity and Gay Rights,
'Cuz its run by political soldiers!"
<span>"When wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains
An' the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to yer rifle, an' blow out your brains,
An' go to yer Gawd like a soldier!"
Or, for 2014
"When Biden directs us to turn out the lights,
Jest hope you don't die in the last of the fights,
For the mission is now Diversity and Gay Rights,
'Cuz its run by political soldiers!"</span>
This sounds more and more like Vietnam...the Democrats will neither fight nor disengage, but sure as sunrise, they will try to blame the defeat on the Republicans.
watching this administration conduct strategic communications is like watching a bunch of drunk coeds singing their university's alma mater. They can sing "We don't know the f-----g words!" very well together, although the timing, pitch, and message get garbled in translation, or do they?
it's ironic, isn't it? The democrats were calling Afghanistan a quagmire and "vietnam" since September 12, 2001 and now here we are and they are fulfilling the prophecy.
Same playbook.
Remember, the recently deceased Democratic Diplomat Star had been in Vietnam
And Kerry got a li'l boo-boo on his finger there too.
but no matter.
We have universal health care....and finally...a military that takes all comers!!!!
I disagree on who is qualified. I believe that with a brain, a sense of honor, quite a bit of historical context, and a knack to weed out the BS, as well as a SET OF BALLS (be the male balls or lady balls [ovaries]), civvies are up to the job. I would trust Kaplan as president over John F. Kerry, Vietnam Veteran who also servied in Vietnam; I would trust Hugh Hewitt over Mike Mullen and I'd totally trust Bobby Jindal over Gary Roughead.
They were very certainly responsible for the Vietnam "Quagmire"
Nixon got half assed tough and forced them to quit drooling on about the table.
You'd be amazed at how many kids think Nixon started that war.
How do I double like this post?
Remember as well that these same Democrats were earlier declaring AFG the fight that needed to be fought, and that IRQ was just something that the Republicans concoted. Now they want to back out of the one operation that they begrudingly admitted was needed. Biden is a light weight.
Amateur night with a bunch of empty suits who have no real world experience. Self-styled, international man of idocy, Joe Biden. Biden couldn't make it as a lawyer; so, like most failed lawyers, he turned to politics. Obama, another failed lawyer, has a history as a rabble rouser much like the young V.I. Lenin. Elections have consequences and we are living with them. Afghanistan is starting to read a lot like the path followed in Dereliction of Duty.
Chris Christy/bolton 2012?
Patraeus.....ah well he isnt interested in politics. Means he smart i guess.
Ah they just want to see these scenes repeated on MSNBC with Olby and Matthews reporting live from the airport. Then turn around and wonder why scenes like this are happening all over that place in the 'Stan.
Sen Biden pullout publicity forecast will not come to pass as described. Otherwise, the Obama administration will be guilty of exactly the same premature celebration as Bush's "Mission Accomplished" (taken entirely out of context) was supposed to represent. Subsequent events that held Bush's feet to the fire in Iraq, will ubdoubtedly occur in Afghanistan.
The message will certainly be more controlled than what PR-meister Biden has in mind.
It's the thought that counts! ;)
Biden is simply the idiot looking for a village.
On the serious side, if we don't plan to fight to win, then we should just leave. Let's drop everything in place and leave. Get out of Dodge as soon as possible. No transition, no nothing. Write off the equipment and leave.
We no longer possess the will to win or even try to win. Let's leave now.
What a tool. I can't believe he felt the need to publicize the policy of an active warzone 4 years in advance.
There is no winning in Afghanistan. Whatever winning we can do we did ten years ago. We cannot make them love us by killing them. It is not the business of the United States to build nations; that is the business of the Afghan people. If they choose to live under a dictator, that is their choice.<span> </span>
As much as I love a good Kipling poem, one has to ask, what is different between us and Great Britain. We are as doomed to failure as they were. We need to leave; tomorrow!
I read the posts about our "weakness" and lack of will; attributes Great Britain's colonial expansion had in spades. Is there an example of an invading power which has successfully occupied the defeated population. Alexander the Great? George III?
When a government reduces a people to, “absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government.” Their right; not ours. Their duty; not ours.
Much as I love a good foreign policy, having a boob like Biden tipping our hand for the world to see fills me with disgust.
Maybe Biden and Mullen can fight the rear-guard action while we turn tail and run, since we have no intention of even trying to win.
<span> </span>It does.
<span> </span>I am proud of any man or woman willing to put on a uniform and serve our country. I am extra proud of a gay man who is willing to stand up to bigotry, and serve. I’m even prouder of the straight men who will set aside their feelings and stand shoulder to shoulder with their gay brothers-in-arms.
<span> </span>I save my disgust for the right wing war wimps; Oxy-addled Rush and his buddies, who are all too willing to send others to war, but never got 'round to going themselves.
<span>'We’re going to be totally of there come hell or high water by 2014.'</span>
<span></span>
<span>Am I the only one to notice that idiot is assuming there's gonna be a second term for the democrats?</span>
<span></span>
<span></span>
But it is our choice to have to send in men to kill them or bombers to expend munitions because they wish to destablize a entire region if they can.
I see the taliban as gaingreen, Cut it out or the infection will spread.
Oh Lordy. You swell with pride at the left-wing hotch-potch of warriors such as Bill and Hillary Clinton, Clueless Joe Biden, B Hussein Obama? You win the coveted Les Aspin award.
You say you're liking it again and then you like your own post.
This war is going to be longer and bloodier than anyone could imagine if we just disengage from Afghanistan and Iraq. Many in this country along with the Administration, think if we just bring all the troops home everything will be okay.
By the way CDR, great clip from an old movie. Lots of great WWI songs, especially the Charlie Chaplin one.
But isn't self-like sort of a sin to the Catholics?
The "infection" already has spread...to many different regions all around the world, it is more prevalent in some than others. But invading each and every one of those would be a fool's errand, even if the U.S. wasn't flat broke.
A coherent case for staying in AFG can be made, but it's based around nation building, not counter terrorism. I don't personally agree with it (reasonable people can disagree), because I don't think this nation, particularly its military, should be in the business of nation building. Furthermore, we have painted ourselves into a corner...we faced a fundamental choice early in the war: either schwack them and leave, or get in for the long haul. We decided to get in for the long haul, but then made two serious errors: first, invaded Iraq (again, a solid case can be made for invading Iraq...I don't necessarily agree with it, but I think reasonable people can disagree. The problem I have is that engaging in one nation building campaign is very expensive on its own...you don't start a second before you've finished the first, especially when your nation's financial structure is built on a house of cards); second, we turned things over to NATO.
Of course, that's all water under the bridge, but those factors are what's driving the situation we find ourselves in today (as well as many other things...I'm not going to sit here and say the war in Iraq is the major driver behind our financial situation, but it did play a part), and I don't see a way out that doesn't involve us leaving shortly, regardless of who is in the White House/in control of Congress. It's simply too expensive and we're too far down the rabbit hole.
That said, Biden is a fucking idiot...even if he's talking about a policy I agree with, you don't publicly state it 4 years in advance.
Nah, GOP will do the exact same thing...I won't rehash the comment I made just below, but suffice to say that there are things driving our withdrawal beyond "DEMOCRATS ARE SURRENDER MONKEYS."
United States vs American Indians comes to mind.
Les Aspin, the man who pushed the US Military off the cliff. How humiliating to admit that he was from Wisconsin. From Wisconsin, but assuredly no Badger,
All Gay...All the time.
Bubbah. When you boysssss clean up your act, I will pay you some mind.
Jeee-ZUS, sid! You gotta warn a guy when you do that! My eyes!
Prom Night or AFG, pulling out early is just a stupid plan. To bad Joe's parents.............
Look i understand what your saying but i guess i've heard far to many people come out with the same basic thing lately.
"why should we care what happens in (insert name) doesnt affect us/not our problem. We shouldn't play world police!"
But in the end many wars have started in random out in BFE places and consumed hundreds of thousands of lives and collapsed empires. How many of those could have been stopped before they got that big?
I just see more and more pilling up behind us and wonder if i will get to see the mountain of Sh*t fall.
US isnt cut for extended wars, it doesnt have the patience... Even WW2, had it continued few years more could be stalemated by axis with a bit of luck, and absent nukes. Imagine Rommel hurrying 19 PzDiv to roll Overlord into sea, and US contemplating invasion on Japan after lessons of Okinawa.
Not sure that AFG is worth it in the long run, given other ruinous ends over thousands of years and an inhospitable culture, climate, and mountains. Coupled with our 2 hour movie mentality, it doesn't look so good. That said, always appreciate your analysis, having been boots 'on. Joe Biden remains, unfortunately, Joe Biden. While it probably sucks to be him, it sucks even more when for those that didn't vote for him when he opens his piehole, and we have to hear what passes as foreign policy expertise. The voters got what they wanted ... two smiling glad handing clowns .... with disastrous results domestically and internationally. 2012 can't come fast enough to kick these sophomoric egotists to the curb and the speaking circuit.
(You might as well have double dog dared us all URR. ;) I clicked. I'm going to go into a convent now so I never have to look at another man again. I'm scarred for life. Thanks, Sid.
(Looking for eye bleach... a sharp fork... something...anything to make it go away....)
And the forecast today? "It's raining men" lol
Sid has an external hard drive full of such pictures ..... don't encourage him. O:-)
Sorry...
But there will be those who insist its their right to engage in such behavior while on AD...
Meanwhile, others will be engaged in more tirival pursuits
Someone pass me the bleach, I need to disinfect my eyes. Sid, next 'Plooza, I'm going to do bad things to you :)
Yes, if only Crazy Joe's dad had pulled out sooner. If only, but then O blah blah would still have found an idiot to be VP w/ him to make him seem smarter.
Speaking of which, we need to all get together again. The conversation is always lively and if I drop a cussword, nobody tries to court martial me, so win win. :)
Sid has mad Google-Fu skills!
Well, I can get the waitress to pour beer in your lap...or on your head :)
Did you know that when wearing a steel helmet, and you tilt your head juuuuusssst right, that you can make the PRF of a SPS-49 audible?
That should explain alot....
I'm always up for a road trip...but given the disaster our national leadership is steering this country into...I fear we may just all be a bit more somber
What is this...the voting members of the front porch politburo?
What is this...the voting members of the front porch politburo?
Yes that is jealousy you detect.
AFAIK Salty, such fetes are ALWAYS inclusive...
And, for full disclosure on the rather ribald link I left above, I work in what is arguably the most gay friendly business outside the fashion industry. As a matter of fact, my best friend here -she is also one of the most universally liked and respected by everyone- is openly gay....But she is real quick to shut down the whole open display of the "Gay Pride" crap in the workplace.
"Gay Pride" is at a crossroads. Lets see how the movement handles legitimacy, and see if it can grow into something responsible.
Oh yeah, she used to be a Red Shirt too....
(thats not her)
Maybe Phib can shift flags to Seafood Kitchen; lot better food, and the front porch (so to speak) of Singletons might be a bit cool this time of the year... Salty, Lt. B has the quarterdeck, you'll have to ask him ;) and he better not come if he doesnt bring his lovely wife =-X
I have to go to that area by edict, wife or not. Last time we went, she made a new friend, so I think I HAVE to bring her so that we can RSVP positively to the dinner invite. She's in if she wants to be, but she does not like our conversations as much. She prefers discussions w/ aviators, not shoes. My stories that start with, "So there I was, at 15 kts," just don't do it for her. :)
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