HSC-84's retro paint job for the Centennial of Naval Aviation. Red Wolf 202 is painted like a HAL Huey from Vietnam.Of note - we have been at war longer now than we were in Vietnam - depending on how you measure it.
In Vietnam, the Navy created and developed fixed and rotary wing squadrons to meet the unique requirements of the war at hand. What have we done? What were our priorities while USA and allied forces bled out due to a lack of proper RW, or were killed outright due to lack of air support - like HAL provided in Vietnam?
Priorities, I presume.
Hat tip BA.
UPDATE: At the 3:30 point, you can see the Seawolves in action - but you should just watch the whole thing.
Very nice, indeed!
ReplyDeleteIt is good to remember the Seawolves and the PBR's. It would be better to have the skills and the assets in reserve. So when we go into the dark room again, we can light it up, early and often. Send no SAR without an escort. Pain to the enemy.
ReplyDeleteWow, look at that. A ship (apparently commanded by a Lt) with a 3 inch gun, bunch of cannons that is supporting helicopters and smaller boats close to shore and in rivers that probably didn't cost several hundred millions of dollars and years of development.
ReplyDeleteMan that brings back memories! The Seawolves defined CAS, that definition I learned when the hot brass from one Seawolf doing a firing run overhead fell on the canopy of my PBR. The pilot came on the radio and asked if that was close enough? You better damn well belive it was! When the Seawolves were scrambed to help us, Charlie kept his head down back where we could not shoot at him and vice versa, ahh but Seawolves could.
ReplyDeleteIt should be noted that many Seawolves have been screaming at naval leaders for NOT providing a dedicated gunship sqaudron to NECC units lke the riverine dets deployed in Iraq. Now that the RivRons are going to other AORs, there is even more of a need. I believe the Navy may get a gunship ron up and running sometime?~
Phase Zero to much higher at the crack of a bullet
P.S. I had the AGPs nee LSTs do NGFS. Let's just say some were good shots some were not. They were mainly for direct fire support. The Coast Guard cutters did good NGFS from close in also with a 5 inch.
Gramps,
ReplyDeleteLast Sunday on Midrats we talked about how such "influence" type units were well suited for reserves during our conversations with CAPT Hendrix. Give it a listen.
Great looking bird!
ReplyDeleteAnd while the good Commander is right that it is a shame the Navy hasn't stood up the equivalent of the Seawolves (and Black Ponies, for that matter), I'll note that the Navy DID send a squadron of MH-53s to augment the Army in Iraq. Thank you. That kind of augmentation makes sense. IIRC, the Navy also supported an air ambulance detachment in Kuwait.
Those deployments make a hell of a lot more sense than shanghaiing 17,000 sailors to make sure staffs get just a little more bloated.
Lee,
ReplyDeleteThe requirement is there. The need is there. The Sailors are available - as for pilots you would have to beat them off with a stick to keep them away from those orders; career implications be d@mned.
Riverine support is just one mission - I have no doubt the SEALs in AFG wouldn't mind having a DET supporting them. Joint support is not what it is cracked up to be. We know how Navy responds when a Shipmate calls, and our rules are a bit more flexible - if allowed - than other services.
You could even leverage the supply of UH-1N and/or the new production run of USMC UH-1Y --- if we had an operationally minded leadership this decade that we needed. It is a no-brainer. I guess warfighting as we have it isn't transformatinal enough.
Sigh; easy, simple and affordable. Even better - it would save American lives and kill the enemy. Wait, what do we call that now days? Oh, that's right - "Shape the Battlespace and influence the domain though the air enterprise."
We even have the aircraft in production, we know what weapons are needed, and they are available off the shelf in storage, and thanks to HAL, we even have doctrines that can be used, modifies, and built on. It would be as close to free as a solution could be. But alas, it would be evolutionary, not revolutionary.l
ReplyDeleteDon't forget TFU's fine work.
ReplyDeleteThere are a lot of good lessons from the past that can be applied to today's battlefield. All the good ideas do not come from staff; in fact, I have found, in my experieince, that most good ideas come from the field. Practical knowledge trumps book knowledge; though they are not mutually exclusive.
ReplyDelete<span></span>
ReplyDelete<span>
Helicopter Combat Support Special Squadron (HCS)
</span><span>
HCS-4
HAL-4 Established 1 Jul 1976
HAL-4 Redesignated HCS-4 1 Oct 1989
HCS-5
HAL-5 Established 1 Mar 1977
HAL-5 Redesignated HCS-5 1 Oct 1988
HCS-5 Destablished 5 Dec 2006
</span>
LST... cheap, efficient way to deliver some tanks to the enemy front door, also capable of being used as bed for mini-helo-carrier, gunship, medevac, you name it...
ReplyDeleteI guess USN has already decomissioned all of them to be replaced by the new and improved death stars... erm LPD-17s
tactical facepalm...
ReplyDelete"We have met the enemy and they are us" Fogo Fossum, err, Pogo Possum (pardon my Lutherian slip).
ReplyDeleteI'm not the only Lutheran here?
ReplyDelete"Shape the battle space": Some damfool army/af doctrinal comic book.
ReplyDelete"The only thing that matters is putting ordnance on target, anything else is rubbish": Von Richtofen,
"You must do the best you can with what you have": King
"Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead": Farragut
"You may fire when ready, Gridley": Farragut
Via Megaphone ship to ship - USS DARTER (CDR C. H. McClintock) to USS DACE (CDR B. D. Claggett "We have CONTACT. Let's GO! "(11 warship task force, sank 2 cruisers, crippled 1 out of the war, and shook the enemy admiral down to his shoes). Lost Darter, crew saved by Dace. Got the sighting report out to ComSubPac and CinCPacFlt.
"My number one priority is increased diversity" You know who. This, nine years into a war, with the issue in doubt.
There seems to be something wrong with our bloody Navy these days. As to what, well, opinions may vary.
Surely Von Richtofens most famous quote is " Stupid beagle ".
ReplyDeleteGB,
ReplyDeleteMaybe we need more William S. Sims in our Navy then Adm Mullens?
What did Patton say? Something like 'we don't want you to die for your country, we want the other bastards to die for their country'
ReplyDeleteI know I butchered it - but the spirit is their 8-)
Sorta like the Besson-class logistics support vessel:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.naval-technology.com/projects/lsv/lsv1.html
this one decision eliminated more useful helos than all of Talebans ground fire that year...
ReplyDeletexbradtc, just so you know... The paint job isn't just bluster - HCS-5 and HCS-4 (now HSC-84) have had a four bird detachment, on the ground, in the IZ AOR since the beginning... CONTINUOUSLY... since Spring of '03. That's right - 2 reserve squadrons have been supporting multinational and US SOF efforts in theater without a break, that is, until HCS-5 was disestablished in '06; now the burden is HSC-84's alone to bear. I'll say it again for those who are in the back row - that's 7.5 YEARS of continuous deployment for a RESERVE element.
ReplyDeleteWe're talking 10s of thousands of combat flight hours at this point, and several thousand sorties of direct action, logistics support and general bad-assery to execute SOCCENT's will. An absolutely unheralded story throughout the navy and one that only a few know of, but since they come from a long line of "quiet professionals" and take ENORMOUS pride in their work, you'll never hear them complain about lack of recognition. Go get 'em RedWolves!!!!
None the less they rate it, so let's get 'em some. Sal?
ReplyDeleteDon't look at me, I'm closer to MacAndrew of MacAndrew's Hymn (Kipling; "Lord , thou hast made
ReplyDeletethis world below the shadow of a dream,
An', taught by time, I tak' it so - exceptin' always Steam...") Or a son of Martha, if you prefer.
Although the urge to nail something to a door is not unknown to me...but you knew that.
We digress...
"You may fire when ready, Gridley" was Dewey, on the Olympia at Manila Bay.
ReplyDeleteFor SHAME that the Army had to point that out!
I certainly hope I didn't give the impression that I wasn't impressed with the work Sailors are doing. I'm not knocking NavAir, and I'm not knocking IAs. I am knocking the Army for sucking up a gazillion sailors, who like YN2 Gauthier pointed out, won't get augmented on their optimally manned ships.
ReplyDeleteI'm sure those sailors do their duty as well as anyone can ask of them. But 9 years in, it's time for the Army to decide what missions it really needs done, and put its own people to work doing them instead of thinking of the Navy as a free lunch.
It's always better to be a Son of Martha.
ReplyDeleteLOL, Star Wars Death Star quote was real military one...
ReplyDeleteWell, I might add one fave of mine:
"We want <span>the</span> <span>big</span> ones! <span>Get</span> <span>the</span> <span>big</span> ones first!"
Adm.Callaghan, first battle of Guadalcanal
... and one big one they did get...
I know where you are coming from in regards to helping your own but I personally operated in support for SEALs in three different deployments. I gave them the same support I would give anyone else. When I flew missions in support of ground forces they were my #1 priority it didn't matter who they were. My unit recieved a NUC for it's support of Marines during Fallujah in 2004 and two of my fellow Apache pilots put it all on the line for sailors when they landed in an improvised LZ to evacuate a gravely wounded special operator in 2007...we were told if they had waited for the MEDEVAC he would have bled out.
ReplyDeleteThat story is located here... http://pao.hood.army.mil/1stcavdiv/news/2008/apr/apr2.htm
Hopefully the Navy does field dedicated assests as you advocate. I welcome everyone who wants to lend a hand and help carry the load.
While I know there are stories out there where aircraft might have left someone hanging, it certanly wasn't anyone I know in 1ACB.
Yeah, perfect. Take the helo varient, put a couple guns, maybe a SeaRAM or something on that and I bet that would be good for a lot of things. Pair it up with some smaller patrol boats.
ReplyDeleteHa! There's even a semi-submarisable version for carrying and supporting those smaller boats.
ReplyDeleteSH paint job. Awesome.
ReplyDeleteOops, red face.
ReplyDeleteYou sir, are entirely correct. Thank you for pointing out that unfortunate oversight. I look forward to returning the favor at the first opportunity.
I figured you were just having a senior moment, and thought "Dewey" but your fingers wouldn't listen and typed "Farragut."
ReplyDeleteThe Red Wolves have done a damn fine job and are proof of concept. My concern is that gunship support for NON-NSW units like NECC may not be recognized as a need by their commanders. I have heard ComRivGruOne talk bout riverinre using UAVs, but got the distinct impression that gunships was a bridge too far?
ReplyDeleteAnd is there more funding for expanding the role to include current ops?
Not being an aviator I got to ask, are the current/new model Seahawks equipped to do maritime CAS?